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Topic: Another green day...

I go outside almost every day.  I spend some time walking the yard debating on herping, or doing yard work of some sort.  I walked around for a while today, nice day...  I'm almost certain I heard a snake in the grass... Something moved in the grass just a few feet from me, but it's tall grass right next to, and into, a large brush pile.  This creature wasn't visible to me, though I was within a few feet, it didn't move very fast... I just guessed snake, but I wasn't putting my hand in there to find out.  Who knows what I'd pull out.  Later on I thought perhaps I smelled a snake... is it normal/ possible to smell a snake a little ways off, and if so, what kinds?  I tried a few spots that I'm just waiting to find something at.  There's a bunch of boards out in the woods and under one of them, there's a few dozen crickets hopping around Every single time I check, but other than a few other bugs, that's it. 
Later on I walked down the driveway, then walked up the road a little. Started walking back the other way and something caught my eye... You know, there's some days I'm out there thinking "am I blind, why can't I find anything?" and other days I'm thinking "man I've got good eyesight..."... today was one for good vision.  About 6-8 feet away from me, in some nice green vines on the ground, was a green snake just sitting there hoping not to get noticed.  I just walked over and picked it up.  They will quite often just sit there hoping you can't see them.  It is a pretty little thing.  A little dull but with some bluish green flecks.  Anyway, that made my day.
I did do some yard work, including moving a wood pile, but I only found one fence lizard and one skink there... Not sure where they all ran off to as there's normally at least a half dozen fence lizards in that wood pile at a time.  I let my daughter release the skink into the newly formed wood pile... she was happy. 
Oh, the other day I was at a friends business and someone brought a snake by. It appeared to be a rat snake, western, and it was about 5 feet long.  This guy was wearing gloves and holding the head quite tightly as to not get bit.  He wanted to kill it... I told him killing snakes was illegal and we'd release it there... but this other guy had chickens with eggs out in the barn so I had him put the snake in my trunk.  I drove back home but stopped near the river, opened the trunk, grabbed a stick, placed it under the nice and calm snake, picked it up and moved it into the brush... Another snake saved...

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Re: Another green day...

I have often found snakes in my back yard, but now I know they were only mere gartner snakes. I wish I could find a worth while snake, but in my new yard, a gartner snake would be nice.I probably would have tried to make it shoo around if I were in your shoes searching your yard, but I'm not you. I would cut my big toe off to find a Western Diamondback Rattler in my back yard. I love that snake, it's so pretty!

when they tested the A-bomb, they had a real fear
The blast will destroy your sweet atmosphere
But far more important as power increases
Was wasting the planet in well-ordered pieces

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Re: Another green day...

Its interesting how people have different preferences.  like the western diamondback.  I'd love to see one, just to say I saw one... other than that I have little interest in them.  I talked to my sister today, her son is visiting me in about a month and a half, and asked if there were any snakes her husband wanted her son to bring back.  At one point he had been interested in a water snake, long story... But he said he only really wanted the western diamonback.  I sure wouldn't send one of those to him anyway, but told him if anything, I'd be more likely to see a pygmy.  He said he wasn't interested in that, just the diamondback...  I look at it and think it's kind of plain, but the  pygmy is so pretty.  And even garter snakes.  So many people just say "oh, yippee, a garter snake..." but they are not only very attractive, they're also quite interesting snakes.  They are far from my favorite, but because of how common they are many people pay little attention to them. 
Actually I really wouldn't want to find any rattle snake in my yard for a few reasons... one being my daughters, two being if my neighbor found out he might sneak up here and find a way to get rid of them.
I told him yesterday that if he ever killed a venomous snake in his yard I wouldn't hold it against him but if he killed a harmless one that he's better off not telling me about it. 
as far as your yard goes grimskraper, you might ask a few others if they have any specific suggestions, but you may be able to encourage them to come to your yard by setting up some sort of wood or metal for them to hide under.  Of course that sort of thing can attract other unwanted things as well as be an eyesore, but those snakes love having lots of places to hide.

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Re: Another green day...

I do beleive that it is illegal to remove ANY wild animals from the state and transport them across state lines,plus ,depending on what state they live in,they will most likely have to apply for a permit to keep a snake,even a nonvenomous species,which they would most likely be rejected for it if it came from the wild in another state and has the possibility of carrying diseases or parasites.

millipede wrote:

I told him yesterday that if he ever killed a venomous snake in his yard I wouldn't hold it against him

I think that comment is a little out of line on a site where the members are commited to these animals,and work hard to educate the public about them. Maybe you should offer to remove them from his yard if/when they show. I get calls all the time to go remove them so that they aren't killed,even when it's not convenient for me to do so,and I'm sure that there are others here that do the same thing.

Braithre Thar Gach Ni

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Re: Another green day...

sorry if you think my comments are out of line.  I know how passionate people are, but I have no doubt you  yourself know people who kill any snake they see.  This guy already told me he kills a lot of snakes. I've talked with him a few times and there's really little I can do.  He already knows that I will remove any snakes for him...  But he has told me a few times how many watersnakes he's shot near the neighbors pond just for fun.  He's a decent guy other than that but how I treat him in respect to that is very delicate.  More people fear snakes and hurt them because of that fear then there are people that love them and respect them.  I know that's not right by any means, but it's not an easy thing to win some of them over.  If I start to think people like that are jerks, I might end up treating them like that... then what happens, I have no friends and these people have no positive influence in regards to the subject of snakes.  It's real easy for passionate people to alienate others.  That's why I can't hold it against him.  But I'll keep on him about it...
I know a lot of people with families and they don't want to share their space with anything venomous.  I don't think it's right to kill something like that, but I still say that I wont hold it against him if he were to kill something he considers a threat.  I know there's a huge difference, but most people kill something that's considered a pest.  I got lectured by someone once because I want to kill black widows in my yard...  pleanty of other people would go to even further extremes than I do try and eradicate them.  There are pleanty of other things that aren't even close to as harmful that people everywhere kill because they're considered pests, and it's so common not many people care. 
I understand this is a reptile site but I do not think my comment is out of line.  I understand and totally respect your feelings on the matter and what the purpose of this site is... 
I guaruntee I'm the only person in the neighborhood who would not kill a snake in their yard, but I'm not going to hold it against any of them.  I'll do my best to share my enthusiasm and knowledge and just hope it wears off on them a little. 
The reason I even said anything is because so far from talking with him I can see that he'll still kill a snake if he feels the need to do so...  Again I don't think it's right to do so, but anytime someone finds a venomous snake in their own yard and they feel the need to kill it, I wont hold it against them... I'd tell them there are other ways to deal with that sort of thing, share some info, and offer to remove things myself, but I still wont hold it against them... But I mentioned it to him because I knew he would still do it but just to make sure he didn't bother telling me about any nonvenomous killings...  Killing a snake you know is harmless because you might be scared or just don't like them goes beyond ignorance in my book. 
If he killed a harmless snake and told me about it I might lecture him and be a bit ticked off but I'd still probably talk to the guy...  but if it was venomous I might just shake my head and say "I wish I was there to relocate it" or something like that. 
I'm sorry if that's hard to understand but that's how I feel on the matter and I don't think I was that out of line.
   Oh, thanks for reminding me about such laws in regards to transporting snakes between states...  My brother in law has begged me for a few different things but I probably would never send him anything for more than a few reasons. 
You know he once said he considered traveling to the carolinas or virginia to collect some timber rattlers to release in NH to help the population there... I doubt he'd ever do it and personally I'd like to see him hold a venomous snake, but it wasn't his brightest idea though his thoughts well intended.  His son has a good early start on learning about snakes, hopefully he'll learn all the right things. 
He'll be here in a month and a half or so... Kory already said he might be willing to share some knowledge with him IF he has the time... anyway...

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Re: Another green day...

It probably would be best to teach this guy how to find things in his own state......teaching the technique certainly isnt border-limited.


as for the neighbor's habits,  you said "I'll do my best to share my enthusiasm and knowledge and just hope it wears off on them a little. " ----- This is definately the way to do things with stubborn people....I cant count the times a friend of ours makes reference to saying how "nuts" we are, and how he's totally admitting that he's a grown man terrified- but yet every time he comes over, he's got his nose pressed to the glass looking at every one we have.

The thing to remember is--- if this guy ( your neighbor ) is so persistant on killing that which you care for- he obviously doesnt care about what is important to you. Its not like he's standing there by the fence saying how he values your opinions and will take that into concideration next time he produces a tale you arent happy about. In fact, we often tell people --- "If you're going to kill these snakes illegally I dont want to hear you brag about it"--- say that to them in front of somebody else and they'll get the point. At least you wont be in the position of having to be the one he tells...over and over again.

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Re: Another green day...

Could you blame a little kid for trying to kill a gartner snake? I tried it all the time because I was terrified. Back in the day a wavy black line in the hot sun made me terrieified, and today it still does, but not as much. Untill I know what it is, I'm frightened, but I havent killed one in years now. But I'm not braging, just bringing up a question.

when they tested the A-bomb, they had a real fear
The blast will destroy your sweet atmosphere
But far more important as power increases
Was wasting the planet in well-ordered pieces

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Re: Another green day...

I'm glad you asked that grimskraper...  That's sort of what I was trying to get at.  There are tons of people that don't know better.  Of course the older they get, the tougher it is to talk to them.  Most people get really set in their ways.  anyway, if you came to this site and you still killed some snakes I might be dissapointed, but I wouldn't think any less of you as a person.  I'd do my best to be a positive influence without getting into lecturing.  Different people react differerently and I think in my case and with others here, different people are better at using different tactics to acheive the same goal.  Personally I put people over animals all the time and with the relationships I might be able to form I use that as an influence in those other areas. 

I hope I wasn't tooooo defensive in my post  I did not think what I said was wrong and I was simply trying to explain myself.  I'm sure there are herpers out there who have close, close family that might even kill a snake.  What if my wife was like that?  I wouldn't love her any less...
In the case of my neighbor...  He doesn't go out of his way to annoy me or tell me those stories... Usually I bring the subject up by asking if he's seen any.  If at some point he was to mention that type of thing just to get a reaction out of me, then perhaps I'd stop associating with him, but who knows.  I think sometimes you can have the best influence on people when you manage to keep your calm even under such attacks.  Anyway, I hope I'm not too confusing here.
grimskraper, personally I would not blame you... I think people, like kids parents, are responsible for teaching kids to respect nature, but it's hard when the parents/people out there have had their own not so positive influence... that's what this site is for and we're all so glad you are here willing to learn and understand snakes...  What's even cooler than that is as you learn you'll be able to spread your enthusiasm and knowledge with others out there whether it be friends or family...

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Re: Another green day...

You know, my dad did have a good influence. I never remember him killing a snake. I do remember him feeling sorry for the snake he hit with a lawn mower one time. We always kept the snakes we found for a day, never killed them, but sometime the babys would meet the neighborhood birds....  then we let them go!  big_smile  But when my dad wasn't around to say no no, I went ahead and threw rocks at them, splashed them with water, and tried to hit them with the lawnmower.My step dad says he will shoot snakes on sight with his 22. As Mystic knows, hes an awful influence. My dad doesn't live in his old house right now, because he was in the hospital and my uncle moved into his house, so that yard that was once a ...... "haunted" yard is now something I miss  sad . But I told him recently that he might be finding some snakes. I haven't offered to remove them, but I've had the thought since before I joined this site. Any of you guys know a place I could dump some gartner snakes off? I realy would like to get them out of there if he finds them. My uncle is a keep to himself man, but he will listen to 3 people mainly. Me, my aunt, and his wife and kids (well 5). So if I tried to influence him, there might be a chance he would listen. But he has a child that is 7, and a 10 month old, and I don't want them to go through what I did. But he has said he wanted a python as a pet. I asked what kind and there was an akward silence. ROFLCOPTER. So maby I could show him how to hold a snake with a gartner before he gets his snake.
Mr.Roberts said he would let me hold "Norbert" some time, so I think I may be able to hold a gartner snake.

when they tested the A-bomb, they had a real fear
The blast will destroy your sweet atmosphere
But far more important as power increases
Was wasting the planet in well-ordered pieces

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Re: Another green day...

I'll say it again, I'm glad you're here learning grimskraper...
I'm sure you can handle a garter snake.  I always take a few seconds before I just lunge at them for a few reasons.  Some garters are quite aggressive and when frightened they are also likely to release that wonderful smelling fluid all over your hands.  So I take a second or two and when i hold them I try to let them feel as comfortable as possible. 
As for handling purposes, I think a python is a good start and garter snake experience wont help much, but if someone doesn't know there are different types of python, chances are they don't know most of the basic care requirements, which can be disasterous.  Hope you don't mind the advice, but without trying to tell him he doesn't know anything, or that you know more, it might not hurt for you to help him research the proper care of pythons(most likely he'll end up with a ball python).  You can either offer some suggestions or simply print some helpful info out and send it to him.